Ich wollte, DGT konnte besser, es war besser wenn.....
All I read is critics from a very narrow point of view. For example not enough levels. Let me make a comparison. I like Jigsaw puzzles. But I would never buy a puzzle from 100 pieces. It would rather be 1000. For children who just start 25 would be beter. The Centaur plays on both levels “friendly” and “challenging” from 25 to 3000 pieces.

A few weeks ago I took my Centaur to my 7 year old grandson. I explained the rules of chess an we started to play. And he loved it. No moves that had to be entered, no pressure on the squares, just move the pieces. Made a mistake? Just take the move back. So now he is playing on a 100 pieces level. And when he gets better to lets say 250 pieces, so will the Centaur.

The Centaur isn’t made to play against other computers, it isn’t made for analyses. It’s made for fun playing chess. It’s perfect for every basic school to teach children to play chess. It’s perfect for a lot of situations. It’s just not good for a chess computer community.

I can understand the disappointment from some of you, but if DGT would change the Centaur into something you want, it would just become another chess computer instead of the unique device it is right now. That would not be desirable in my opinion and a big disappointment to everyone who loves it the way it is. No matter how imperfect it looks to you, for me it’s just great the way it is.

Hi,

thanks for sharing your point of view, which is totally legitim and correct.

But not sure if it reflects the major issue.

I think it has its market and that's absolutely fine, the issue that I have, is completely different : it just do not improve my chess !

OK, it depends overall on myself and other chess-c might not do better, but the most disturbing fact is , that it plays no human chess at all, it offers you artificial advantages to maintain a level - whatever its sacrifice.

Therefore I handle it like you, let my grandson have fun*), and from time to time, me too.

One can keep it simple like that, or give expert evidences of proof, the result (for me) won't change : it's a "simple" chess buddy toy (which I don't mean in a negativ matter.)

There is not even a major conflict between the item and its advertising, in my opinion.

Regards

*) It might be a "door opener" for future chess interests, but even for an absolut beginner, after a first enthusiasm it becomes quickly frustrating.

Hi Nisse,

I think you're right. For chess players with a certain level the Centaur will not improve your chess.
I think it's impossible to make a chess computer that fulfills everybody's whishes.

For a high level player the Centaur will not play human like, but for low level players it does, because they can't look further behind the obvious mistake.
I'm obviously a low level player. 😉

Well, not sure if a sc like centaur is not good at all to improve a low level player.

I'm e.g. a terrible bad player and any internet chess is catastrophic for me, because I am paired with very bad players too, so this won't get me progressed.

Therefore I have to play against a SC only, but it should be something that allows to export pgn, to share with coach and analyse after a match.

Btw, having fun is important for motivation, but fun only won't help.

"Mit der Schule ist es wie mit der Medizin: Sie muss bitter schmecken, sonst nützt sie nichts!" (H.Rühmann, "Die Feuerzangenbowle")

Well... I AM sure about this fact. How will you ever be able to improve your chess with the centaur? If you make a mistake, the centaur will also make one, maybe one or two moves later. He will not give you a hint, where you made a mistake. That's the problem. Of course. If you lost a pawn or a knight (or whatever) for nothing, you will recognize it yourself. But will he explain that you got a bad position because you didn't take care of open lines or diagonals? No. Will he explain, that the structure of your pawns is bad? No.

Maybe someone took some advantages from playing with the centaur. I don't know. But then I would be interested to hear, in what way the centaur improved the playing abilities of this user. What did you learn and how?

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Mein Profil beim ICCF (International Correspondence Chess Federation)
https://www.iccf.com/player?id=89948&tab=3

There are people who just want to play a game of chess. I have no intention of improving my level, I just play for fun.
So, everyone has his own point of view. I think that the Centaur is such a specific chess computer that most serious players will dislike it, but the low level recreation players just love it.

That's OK for me. If one has no intention to prove his level, then the Centaur maybe a good chess-partner. I can't understand that one wants a partner who is not even in the same universe like the word "challenging" but OK.
But you wrote: "For chess players with a certain level the Centaur will not improve your chess". and therefore I answered that I don't see a chance for anyone to improve his chess with this computer. Not even for a very low level player. For that, you would need functions for analysing, the centaur doesn't have. Just my 2 cent.

__________________
Mein Profil beim ICCF (International Correspondence Chess Federation)
https://www.iccf.com/player?id=89948&tab=3

Hallo Leute,

ich kriege ein bisschen kognitive Dissonanz, wenn ich in diesem Thread lese, der Centaur "Friendly" wäre Kanonenfutter für jedermann.

Ich habe einen Centaur mutmaßlich aus der neuesten Serie 2021, und ich habe echt zu kämpfen. Ohne Tipps und Rücknahmen habe ich bei drei Partien bisher nicht gewonnen

Ja, es gibt unnatürliche Züge. Centaur spielt zum Beispiel eine 3-zügige Kombination um einen gesunden Mehrbauern zu erhalten, heimst den Bauern im letzten Zug der Kombi aber nicht ein

Kann es sein, dass es eine Streuung bei den Centauren untereinander gibt oder dass jeder Centaur gute und schlechte Tage hat?

Schöne Grüße
Theo

PS: meine Einschätzung war eigentlich, dass ich zumindest auf Friendly was reissen kann. https://lichess.org/@/samisdat/perf/blitz

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Meine Schachfotos
Schachcomputer

PMS?

Partielles meisterliches Schachtalent?

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Wirkliche Anarchie kann nur funktionieren, wenn sich alle an die Regeln halten. (Horst Evers)

Theo, ich kenne den Centauer zwar nicht aus eigener Erfahrung. Aber ich nehme an, Du musst "strategischer" an die Sache ran gehen. Also erst absichtlich ein paar kleinere oder etwas größere Fehler machen. Dann warten bis der Centauer sich "revanchiert" bzw. Deine Fehler mit noch größeren überkompensiert.
Und dann das Ding heim schaukeln.

Ein probates Rezept gegen adaptiv spielende Progrmme kann sein:
1. e2-e4 e7-e5
2. Lf1-c4 ...
3. Lc4xf7 +? Ke8xf7
...Damit steht Schwarz materiell besser, wird dieses jedoch ausgleichen. Übrig bleibt die schlecht Königsstellung...

Gruß
Wolfgang