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Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Zitieren:

Zitat von hap (Beitrag 128347)

Supra shows the moves on the LCD, are you sure? The manual says it's for total time. There's no videos of Supra on youtube, but there's one old video of Royal and I didn't see moves shown on the LCD either.

For that reason, I was (still partially am) suspecting they went for the cheap solution and used a wristwatch or stopwatch IC.

You are right it is clock only, I just turned it on. It has been such a long time since I last used it.

Regards
Nick

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Sorry, I had edited my post a few minutes ago to request a photo of the front side of the LCD PCB. If you have to do it all over again, never mind, I don't want to burden you. =)

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Zitieren:

Zitat von hap (Beitrag 128350)

Sorry, I had edited my post a few minutes ago to request a photo of the front side of the LCD PCB. If you have to do it all over again, never mind, I don't want to burden you. =)

No worries, here it is. It is about as big as I can get it.

https://www.spacious-mind.com/schachinfo/Supra2.jpg

Regards
Nick

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Thanks, definitely software-controlled display. No LCD driver chip indeed. I didn't realize at first that it's actually 2*2 ribbon cables on top of each other.

Strange that they didn't solder the LCD panel.

The Supra only has 1 LCD compared to Royal, so I guess it only tracks time for white? Or does it switch to black's total time when it's the computer's turn?

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Zitieren:

Zitat von hap (Beitrag 128352)

It switches from white to black and so on, total time.

Regards

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

LCD panel is 34 pins. 2 outputs from ribbon cable go to 2 LCD corner pins, possibly VCC/GND.
Then 15 outputs each go to 2 LCD pins, very odd.
2 LCD pins are N/C.

The LCD has 4 7-segment digits, or does it have more segments? Like a blinking colon (I didn't see any on photos online), or DP (display point, at bottom-right of a digit).

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Zitieren:

Zitat von hap (Beitrag 128354)

LCD panel is 34 pins. 2 outputs from ribbon cable go to 2 LCD corner pins, possibly VCC/GND.
Then 16 outputs each go to 2 LCD pins, very odd.

The LCD has 4 7-segment digits, or does it have more segments? Like a blinking colon (I didn't see any on photos online), or DP (display point, at bottom-right of a digit).

I don't see any blinking colons. It counts from right to left. Once it gets to sixty it switches to the third digit and shows a 1 the fourth digit remains at zero so you have to wait to 10 minutes before the 4th digit would change. I don't want to run it that long but the 4th digit probably goes to 99 minutes before it goes back to zero. (That's my guess).

From a display perspective you have two left digits and two right digits with a small gap in the middle that is dark (no ticking dots).

When the computer is thinking it has a small LED called "Think" that lights up red. There are 4 small LEDs there from top to bottom called "Level" "Set-UP" "Think" and "Threat".

Regards
Nick

Re: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

You know, computers like the Supra, Royal, other CXG's and some Excalibur's their maximum level 64 only plays at maximum 20-25 seconds per move. These are the types of computers where it would be really great if revised versions could be created where levels are changed to add maybe 30 seconds and 3 minutes per move. That would really allow us to see what their play strengths are. If that were ever possible.

Regards
Nick

AW: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Nick, die Seville-Klone gucken ja nur 1 Ply voraus, darum brauchen sie auf dem höchsten Level nur ca 30 Sekunden.

Siehe mein Post:
https://www.schachcomputer.info/foru...8&postcount=13

David Levy hatte mir mal die Funktionsweise dieser 1-ply Schachcomputer erklärt, hier ein kleiner Auszug aus seinem Mail:

Zitieren:

Yes, you are right that it is basically a swapoff algorithm.

Because of the RAM limitation I came up with the idea of evaluating each square on the board sequentially, and when the calculations for a square were completed the net score for that square was added to a cumulative value. From what I remember there were three main components for the square score - one was a positional evaluation (each piece gets a certain score for the square it is on); one is a mobility count - 1 point for each piece that attacks this square; and the most significant was the swapoff value. I don't recall if there was anything sophisticated in the swapoff, for example a rook acting through a queen is different to a queen acting through a rook, and I can't recall if there was an upper limit on the number of men on each side which could participate in the swapoff on a particular square, but I do recall that it worked reasonably well. If, as I suspect, you have one or more of the products using my algorithm, you could conduct some tests in order to work out the level of sophistication of the swapoff function.

There were also some bonus scores but I can't recall the details, though I believe one of them was a "push passed pawn" bonus; one was a penalty for losing castling rights. Until a few years ago I still had the source code, but then a pipe burst in my cellar and the paper was destroyed.

I also devised an algorithm for mating with KRvK and with KQvK - both were rule based I think, and both were in the code.

...

The algorithm starts by looking at square a1. It cycles through every piece on the board and when it encounters one which attacks a1 it adds to the "score for the current square" variable whatever is the appropriate score for that piece.

AW: Mess Emulator für diverse Schachcomputer ist fertig!

Bereits 1979 schreibt Levy über den static swap off evaulator, in
http://www.chesscomputeruk.com/PCW_May_1979.pdf

https://www.schachcomputer.info/foru...8&d=1726653384